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	<title>Comments for Treasuring Christ</title>
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	<link>http://treasuringchrist.net</link>
	<description>Spreading a passion for treasuring Christ above all things personally, for the glory of God corporately, and to the joy of all peoples globally.</description>
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		<title>Comment on No Salvation by Faith Alone by Brian</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1510&#038;cpage=1#comment-468</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Jan 2011 02:19:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1510#comment-468</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[No, what I understand Clark to say (in this quote, of course) is that it&#039;s faith + works. 

As for the 1 Corinthians quote - are you sure Paul is talking about being disqualified from salvation? I&#039;ve never read it that way.

As for the Philippians verse, I must agree that the two words together &quot;fear and trembling&quot; have me confused a little how they fit into the scheme of things. Generally, here&#039;s my take: there&#039;s the warning against approaching God casually, instead with a great deal of reverence and awe recognizing that in Him is the power to save us and to damn us.

As for your point from Colossians, certainly there is a HUGE deception factor and all of us need to examine ourselves and fall to our knees asking God to examine our hearts, grant to us repentance for our sins and to restore our relationship to Him. This ability to be deceived is REAL and I&#039;m convinced that it plagues many who call themselves believers.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No, what I understand Clark to say (in this quote, of course) is that it&#8217;s faith + works. </p>
<p>As for the 1 Corinthians quote &#8211; are you sure Paul is talking about being disqualified from salvation? I&#8217;ve never read it that way.</p>
<p>As for the Philippians verse, I must agree that the two words together &#8220;fear and trembling&#8221; have me confused a little how they fit into the scheme of things. Generally, here&#8217;s my take: there&#8217;s the warning against approaching God casually, instead with a great deal of reverence and awe recognizing that in Him is the power to save us and to damn us.</p>
<p>As for your point from Colossians, certainly there is a HUGE deception factor and all of us need to examine ourselves and fall to our knees asking God to examine our hearts, grant to us repentance for our sins and to restore our relationship to Him. This ability to be deceived is REAL and I&#8217;m convinced that it plagues many who call themselves believers.</p>
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		<title>Comment on No Salvation by Faith Alone by Elijah Layfield</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1510&#038;cpage=1#comment-467</link>
		<dc:creator>Elijah Layfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Jan 2011 18:45:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1510#comment-467</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This doesn&#039;t undermine security, it makes sense out of it.  All of our security is in Christ, as with our righteousness.  As long as we are connected to Christ by faith that works itself out in love, then we are secure.  But, there is a reality of deception as Paul writes in Colossians 1.21-23.

&quot;And you, who once were alienated and hostile in mind, doing evil deeds, 22he has now reconciled in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and above reproach before him, if indeed you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard, which has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, became a minister&quot; (Colossians 1:21-23 ESV).

If you continue...not shifting from the hope.  There is what we must fear.

Neither I nor Clark have said we must work in order to be saved.  But, there is no working out, then there is no salvation.

Even Paul realized that he could be disqualified from salvation.  &quot;But I discipline my body and keep it under control, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified&quot; (1 Corinthians 9:27 ESV).  His working out of his salvation through sanctification and obedience was his discipline of his body, keeping it under control.  

How are you interpreting fear from that passage in Philippians?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This doesn&#8217;t undermine security, it makes sense out of it.  All of our security is in Christ, as with our righteousness.  As long as we are connected to Christ by faith that works itself out in love, then we are secure.  But, there is a reality of deception as Paul writes in Colossians 1.21-23.</p>
<p>&#8220;And you, who once were alienated and hostile in mind, doing evil deeds, 22he has now reconciled in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and above reproach before him, if indeed you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel that you heard, which has been proclaimed in all creation under heaven, and of which I, Paul, became a minister&#8221; (Colossians 1:21-23 ESV).</p>
<p>If you continue&#8230;not shifting from the hope.  There is what we must fear.</p>
<p>Neither I nor Clark have said we must work in order to be saved.  But, there is no working out, then there is no salvation.</p>
<p>Even Paul realized that he could be disqualified from salvation.  &#8220;But I discipline my body and keep it under control, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified&#8221; (1 Corinthians 9:27 ESV).  His working out of his salvation through sanctification and obedience was his discipline of his body, keeping it under control.  </p>
<p>How are you interpreting fear from that passage in Philippians?</p>
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		<title>Comment on No Salvation by Faith Alone by Brian</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1510&#038;cpage=1#comment-466</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Jan 2011 17:24:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1510#comment-466</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I see your point. You&#039;ve stated it well. It sounds as though your fear is based upon a lack of security - isn&#039;t there now NO condemnation for those in Christ Jesus (Romans 8:1); The Apostle John writes to us that we may know that we have eternal life (1 John 5:13) - is there no security for the believer? 

Yes, we must examine ourselves (2 Cor 13:15). We must endure to the end. Our lives must produce fruit as evidence of our conversion. But must we live in fear of falling away to damnation? I say - NO. It may be merely semantics, but: Must we work to be saved? No. Will we work if we are saved: a resounding YES.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I see your point. You&#8217;ve stated it well. It sounds as though your fear is based upon a lack of security &#8211; isn&#8217;t there now NO condemnation for those in Christ Jesus (Romans 8:1); The Apostle John writes to us that we may know that we have eternal life (1 John 5:13) &#8211; is there no security for the believer? </p>
<p>Yes, we must examine ourselves (2 Cor 13:15). We must endure to the end. Our lives must produce fruit as evidence of our conversion. But must we live in fear of falling away to damnation? I say &#8211; NO. It may be merely semantics, but: Must we work to be saved? No. Will we work if we are saved: a resounding YES.</p>
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		<title>Comment on No Salvation by Faith Alone by Elijah Layfield</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1510&#038;cpage=1#comment-464</link>
		<dc:creator>Elijah Layfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 Jan 2011 05:51:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1510#comment-464</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[B,

I think that Clark is saying that justification is a part of salvation, but not the whole of it.  That is exactly how I interpret Romans 8.29-30.  Justification is a link in the chain of redemption.  

Justification is primarily (to quote Grudem) &quot;An instantaneous legal act of God in which he (1) thinks of our sins as forgiven and Christ&#039;s righteousness as belonging to us, and (2) declares us to be righteous in his sight.&quot;

In Romans 6, justification is the source of the fruit and what leads to sanctification and its end, eternal life.  Where there is no justification there is no sanctification nor salvation.  Faith is the entrance into all of that by justification, but it is not the sum of our salvation.  Paul states that is it necessary here to have sanctification.  As Hebrews 12.14 points out, &quot;Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord&quot; (Hebrews 12:14 ESV).  In the process of sanctification and obedience, Clark points out that these &quot;consist of external actions initiated by internal volitions.&quot;  All of this motivated from a renewed heart made alive to God, trusting in Christ&#039;s righteousness as the motivation for the works, not the ground for their approval.  That&#039;s what removes the stigma of salvation by works alone.  Remember, even James (2.24) says that we are justified by works, because a faith that has no works is no faith at all.  

To work out our salvation is to keep on believing, keep on repenting, and keep on obeying.  We fear because the heart is deceitfully wicked and we can fall away--proving that we never actually were justified.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>B,</p>
<p>I think that Clark is saying that justification is a part of salvation, but not the whole of it.  That is exactly how I interpret Romans 8.29-30.  Justification is a link in the chain of redemption.  </p>
<p>Justification is primarily (to quote Grudem) &#8220;An instantaneous legal act of God in which he (1) thinks of our sins as forgiven and Christ&#8217;s righteousness as belonging to us, and (2) declares us to be righteous in his sight.&#8221;</p>
<p>In Romans 6, justification is the source of the fruit and what leads to sanctification and its end, eternal life.  Where there is no justification there is no sanctification nor salvation.  Faith is the entrance into all of that by justification, but it is not the sum of our salvation.  Paul states that is it necessary here to have sanctification.  As Hebrews 12.14 points out, &#8220;Strive for peace with everyone, and for the holiness without which no one will see the Lord&#8221; (Hebrews 12:14 ESV).  In the process of sanctification and obedience, Clark points out that these &#8220;consist of external actions initiated by internal volitions.&#8221;  All of this motivated from a renewed heart made alive to God, trusting in Christ&#8217;s righteousness as the motivation for the works, not the ground for their approval.  That&#8217;s what removes the stigma of salvation by works alone.  Remember, even James (2.24) says that we are justified by works, because a faith that has no works is no faith at all.  </p>
<p>To work out our salvation is to keep on believing, keep on repenting, and keep on obeying.  We fear because the heart is deceitfully wicked and we can fall away&#8211;proving that we never actually were justified.</p>
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		<title>Comment on No Salvation by Faith Alone by Elijah Layfield</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1510&#038;cpage=1#comment-460</link>
		<dc:creator>Elijah Layfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Jan 2011 19:58:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1510#comment-460</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Brian,

How do you interpret Philippians 2.12-13?  &quot;Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure&quot; (ESV).]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Brian,</p>
<p>How do you interpret Philippians 2.12-13?  &#8220;Therefore, my beloved, as you have always obeyed, so now, not only as in my presence but much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling, for it is God who works in you, both to will and to work for his good pleasure&#8221; (ESV).</p>
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		<title>Comment on No Salvation by Faith Alone by Brian</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1510&#038;cpage=1#comment-459</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Jan 2011 18:13:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1510#comment-459</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[First of all, I&#039;m glad to see you posting and writing again.

Secondly, I&#039;d like to chime in on this quote - I&#039;m not saying that this guy is wrong, but I will say he&#039;s splitting hairs that are not necessary to be split:

&quot;For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.&quot; Romans 8:29-30 ESV http://esv.to/Rm8.26-30

Those He justified he also glorified - is this not salvation?

Once again: &quot;But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the fruit you get leads to sanctification and its end, eternal life.&quot; Romans 6:22 ESV http://esv.to/Rm6.22

Does this verse not say, in essence, that the &quot;fruit&quot; of justification (being set free from sin) leads to sanctification and it&#039;s end, eternal life - sounds like salvaiton to me!

I don&#039;t know Mr. Clark, but that sounds a whole lot like salvation by works to me.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>First of all, I&#8217;m glad to see you posting and writing again.</p>
<p>Secondly, I&#8217;d like to chime in on this quote &#8211; I&#8217;m not saying that this guy is wrong, but I will say he&#8217;s splitting hairs that are not necessary to be split:</p>
<p>&#8220;For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.&#8221; Romans 8:29-30 ESV <a href="http://esv.to/Rm8.26-30" rel="nofollow">http://esv.to/Rm8.26-30</a></p>
<p>Those He justified he also glorified &#8211; is this not salvation?</p>
<p>Once again: &#8220;But now that you have been set free from sin and have become slaves of God, the fruit you get leads to sanctification and its end, eternal life.&#8221; Romans 6:22 ESV <a href="http://esv.to/Rm6.22" rel="nofollow">http://esv.to/Rm6.22</a></p>
<p>Does this verse not say, in essence, that the &#8220;fruit&#8221; of justification (being set free from sin) leads to sanctification and it&#8217;s end, eternal life &#8211; sounds like salvaiton to me!</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t know Mr. Clark, but that sounds a whole lot like salvation by works to me.</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Interpretation of Prophecy, Part Nine by Brian</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1426&#038;cpage=1#comment-441</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 09 Sep 2010 02:40:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1426#comment-441</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;ve NEVER claimed to have a good hold on eschatology, but I would certainly fall in a post-trib or mid-trib pre-millennial crowd. 

Just thought I&#039;d ask.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve NEVER claimed to have a good hold on eschatology, but I would certainly fall in a post-trib or mid-trib pre-millennial crowd. </p>
<p>Just thought I&#8217;d ask.</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Interpretation of Prophecy, Part Nine by Elijah Layfield</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1426&#038;cpage=1#comment-439</link>
		<dc:creator>Elijah Layfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Sep 2010 22:40:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1426#comment-439</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I believe in a post-tribulation, pre-millennial eschatology.  I don&#039;t agree with Fairbairn, I&#039;m just summarizing his material.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe in a post-tribulation, pre-millennial eschatology.  I don&#8217;t agree with Fairbairn, I&#8217;m just summarizing his material.</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Interpretation of Prophecy, Part Nine by Brian</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1426&#038;cpage=1#comment-438</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 08 Sep 2010 17:17:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1426#comment-438</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[In what eschatalogical camp do you subscribe, Elijah?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In what eschatalogical camp do you subscribe, Elijah?</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Names of God by Brian</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1445&#038;cpage=1#comment-425</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Aug 2010 16:45:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1445#comment-425</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Thanks for this post, Elijah. I love learning more about how the scriptures name and describe God.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for this post, Elijah. I love learning more about how the scriptures name and describe God.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Radical, by David Platt by Brian</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1372&#038;cpage=1#comment-415</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 10 May 2010 18:31:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1372#comment-415</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This seems to be a great, honest review. I&#039;ve heard David Platt on multiple occasions and have also found some of the things he says sounding like they&#039;re highly influenced by Piper. I&#039;m surprised that he&#039;s not referenced at all.

I have not sought out this book yet as it&#039;s a new release, but understanding that it&#039;s short in length and that it&#039;s Platt&#039;s first book, I didn&#039;t expect it to delve too deeply - simply a hard, biblical call to radical living. It sounds like you&#039;ve given an honest review.

BTW, I&#039;m glad that you&#039;ve described your starring system. Thank you for the clarity!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This seems to be a great, honest review. I&#8217;ve heard David Platt on multiple occasions and have also found some of the things he says sounding like they&#8217;re highly influenced by Piper. I&#8217;m surprised that he&#8217;s not referenced at all.</p>
<p>I have not sought out this book yet as it&#8217;s a new release, but understanding that it&#8217;s short in length and that it&#8217;s Platt&#8217;s first book, I didn&#8217;t expect it to delve too deeply &#8211; simply a hard, biblical call to radical living. It sounds like you&#8217;ve given an honest review.</p>
<p>BTW, I&#8217;m glad that you&#8217;ve described your starring system. Thank you for the clarity!</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Word About Reviews by Radical, by David Platt &#124; Treasuring Christ</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1366&#038;cpage=1#comment-413</link>
		<dc:creator>Radical, by David Platt &#124; Treasuring Christ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 09 May 2010 19:54:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1366#comment-413</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] 3 out 5 stars. [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] 3 out 5 stars. [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on A Word About Reviews by Tweets that mention Treasuring Christ A Word About Reviews - Doing any type of review is generally a subjective thing anyway, but in th... -- Topsy.com</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1366&#038;cpage=1#comment-410</link>
		<dc:creator>Tweets that mention Treasuring Christ A Word About Reviews - Doing any type of review is generally a subjective thing anyway, but in th... -- Topsy.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 07 May 2010 19:09:44 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Brian Murphy. Brian Murphy said: Treasuring Christ A Word About Reviews - Doing any type of review is generally a subjective thing anyway, but in th... http://ow.ly/17izbQ [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Brian Murphy. Brian Murphy said: Treasuring Christ A Word About Reviews &#8211; Doing any type of review is generally a subjective thing anyway, but in th&#8230; <a href="http://ow.ly/17izbQ" rel="nofollow">http://ow.ly/17izbQ</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on In the Stillness Before a Storm by Tweets that mention In the Stillness Before a Storm &#124; Treasuring Christ -- Topsy.com</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=1305&#038;cpage=1#comment-409</link>
		<dc:creator>Tweets that mention In the Stillness Before a Storm &#124; Treasuring Christ -- Topsy.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 May 2010 17:20:21 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Brian Murphy. Brian Murphy said: Treasuring Christ In the Stillness Before a Storm - The whole creation has been groaning together in the pains of c... http://ow.ly/17fHIZ [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Brian Murphy. Brian Murphy said: Treasuring Christ In the Stillness Before a Storm &#8211; The whole creation has been groaning together in the pains of c&#8230; <a href="http://ow.ly/17fHIZ" rel="nofollow">http://ow.ly/17fHIZ</a> [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on How God Pours Out Judgment by Tweets that mention How God Pours Out Judgment &#124; Treasuring Christ -- Topsy.com</title>
		<link>http://treasuringchrist.net/?p=509&#038;cpage=1#comment-407</link>
		<dc:creator>Tweets that mention How God Pours Out Judgment &#124; Treasuring Christ -- Topsy.com</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 May 2010 00:58:02 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Brian Murphy. Brian Murphy said: Treasuring Christ How God Pours Out Judgment - &quot;There was not a city that made peace with the people of Israel exce... http://ow.ly/17fkhB [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] This post was mentioned on Twitter by Brian Murphy. Brian Murphy said: Treasuring Christ How God Pours Out Judgment &#8211; &quot;There was not a city that made peace with the people of Israel exce&#8230; <a href="http://ow.ly/17fkhB" rel="nofollow">http://ow.ly/17fkhB</a> [...]</p>
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